Disciplinary Decisions in EC Spring 2014

This topic is used for publishing disciplinary decisions made by the Admin that relate to the EC Spring 2014 tournament. The topic is open for discussion but only in relevance to the rules and the decisions made upon them.

— 1. Case HC Sika vs. Suomi Predators

This first disciplinary press release deals with the events of the European Hockey League 2013 Playoffs series between HC Sika and Suomi Predators. The games ended 15-0 and 45-0. Suomi Predators was not even trying to win the games and showed severe disrespect of their opponent and the rules of the tournament. In the second game Hanssonni, who was the captain, let his friend play in net and this friend was not a part of the team nor registered on Consolehockey. Here are the rule sections that are relevant to the case and that were applied in the disciplinary decisions:

General Rules

2 Registration of member accounts

1§ Player who wants to participate in a tournament has to register an account on Consolehockey.
By registering an account the member hereby acknowledge that the member has read, and accepted these general rules.
2§ A player may only register one account per console.
A player who violates this article will receive a permanent ban from Consolehockey and future tournaments arranged by said website. A player who knowingly assists another member in violating this article will receive a permanent ban.

5 Code of conduct
2§ Registered member must behave in a respectful manner towards fellow members and TGMA.
3§ Members are not allowed to use overtly profane language or otherwise behave in an inappropriate way.
6§ TGMA is responsible for determining what type of behaviour violates the code of conduct.

Tournament Rules

2 Responsibility of complying with rules
1§ Captain of a team has the outermost responsibility for his team and his members and to his capability make sure these follow both general and tournament rules.

5 Rules for Teams
2§ Teams are only allowed to use players registered in their roster. Failure to comply with this article will result in a technical 0-5 loss. Note that a player is only considered registered to his team when he is in the roster. An unregistered player will not be sanctioned since the responsibility for his participation rests on the captain of the team.

6 Violations

1§ Without a stated rule, any action by Consolehockey’s members cannot be seen as a violation of any kind.
2§ Any member who violates the general rules notwithstanding the rules in section 2 could result in up to 3 months ban.
3§ A banned player are not allowed to participate in tournaments arranged by Consolehockey.

Verdict

In accordance to the rules listed above and the fact that Hanssonni made the biggest infringement while also being the captain of the team – and ultimately responsible for its actions –I thereby ban Hanssonni from this spring’s tournaments on Consolehockey. The use of an unregistered player would justify a permanent ban, but it was scaled down due the Admin's judgement.

The rest of the ex Suomi Predators squad that played in the playoff games against HCS will get a warning as defined in the rulebook:

6 Violations
4§ TGMA can issue a warning to any member or team if they are close to a violation that imposes sanctions according to either the general or tournament rules. Warnings are not considered as sanctions, but a notification that continuing the behaviour or action could result in a violation.

List of warned players:

flyhail028 / Flyhail028
Jonde20 / SleepyHollow94
Kefler45 / Kefler x 45
Temetsuka / Temetsuka
WinnieWille / I WILL3 I

— 2. Case 'Nomen est omen': Hardwell & Pure Insanity

I am truely dissapointed to have to write the second disciplinary report about the same team and person(s) as the first one.

Pure Insanity (ex Suomi Preadotrs) registered for the tournament with a player called Hardwell in their roster. The evidence is compelling and beyond any reasonable doubt that Hardwell is indeed recently banned Hanssonni with a new account, of which his team was completely aware of and tried to help cover it up. Here is why:

1. Looking back at match reports from the time Hanssonni played with Pure Insanity there is an interesting phenomenom: Hanssonni has changed into Hardwell. This was confirmed from multiple teams.
2. Hardwell’s points in EASHL match those of Hanssonni’s
3. There was a minor change in the IP address of Hanssonni->Hardwell, but from the critical parts it was the same. I tracked both IP addresses and they were from the same, fairly small locally operating ISP provider. Hardwell’s IP was traced to Hanssonni’s home town.
4. Hanssonni’s team mates locked their friendlists in an attempt to cover up the scheme.

Ruling & Verdict

General Rules

2 Registration of member accounts

1§ Player who wants to participate in a tournament has to register an account on Consolehockey.
By registering an account the member hereby acknowledge that the member has read, and accepted these general rules.
2§ A player may only register one account per console.
A player who violates this article will receive a permanent ban from Consolehockey and future tournaments arranged by said website. A player who knowingly assists another member in violating this article will receive a permanent ban.


Tournament Rules

2 Responsibility of complying with rules

1§ Captain of a team has the outermost responsibility for his team and his members and to his capability make sure these follow both general and tournament rules.
2§ The Captain is not responsible for matters he cannot affect or control. This does not include players leaving the team. A captain chooses which players he wants to add and therefore he can affect the roster of the team.
3§ Players are responsible for following the rules and decisions made by TGMA.


Permanently banned players:

Hardwell/Hanssonni
Jonde20 (SleepyHollow 94) C
Priest of eviL (Priest of eviL) A
Kefler 45 (Kefler x 45) A

Tournament ban:

Stormi (stormspeed)
Spud (spud153)
HocKeyProphEt (TKafSWEDEN)
DGS (I am a sPjK nil)
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52 comments

billy44
I understand General rule 2.2 to mean that if you have several Xbox accounts or help someone do that on CH, you're gonna be perma-banned. I don't know what exactly happened (apart from the 45-0 game report) but according to your story it seems to me like his buddy had zero account, not several. So I don't know if the perma-ban is applicable.

Then again, maybe the perma-ban is also applicable to rule 2.1 just before and Hanssonni is screwed. Or you could say «new tournament, updated rules» and this applicability topic becomes moot. Or you could say tourney ban is a good middle ground between perma-ban and like a one game suspension or whatever… Because let's face it, Hanssonni fucked up (in more ways than one but as a player, only there I think...) and I don't think you'll find too many people who would defend him.

I guess what I'm saying is I don't mind the ruling. And also I take this opportunity to bump this topic to the right side column so people see it.
EstoniaDeluxe
billy44, No you understand it wrong. Why would Administrators on Consolehockey.com have anything to say about what happens on Xbox Live and on peoples accounts there?

What it means is that you're only allowed to have 1 account for each console here. Otherwise you could play on several teams at once, in the same tournament. If Admins catch someone doing that they will be banned for sure.
billy44
I meant several accounts on consolehockey, but all for Xbox tournaments. That's what I meant by «Xbox account on CH». So you understand me wrong, but I guess I might not have worded it perfectly too.

Anyway, my understanding was that the perma-ban was applicable to 2.2, but maybe not 2.1. That's what I was wondering about. Not some trivial stuff.
Comment updated:
janbo
billy44,

Indeed the rule is not very clear on which sanctions are imposed on 2.1. The second article on Violations says that violating the general rules could end you up with a 3 month ban, unless the violation happens on rules in section 2 «Registeration of member accounts». The only sanction this section talks about is a permanent ban. So it is not very clear what the rulebook suggests here and that's one of the reasons why it's being partially re-written. Anyways, I think permaban in this case is exaggerated to say the least and was not therefore enforced.
Temetsuka
When I think about all this afterwards Im really ashamed of myself.  I could have taken a penalty with «pride» but I will take this warning seriously and usually I dont behave like this (or I dont think anyone in SP). But I guess you become stupid in a group like they say  Anyway, sorry HC Sika
janbo
Unfortunately it was time to update the original post with a «new» case.

Temetsuka, good job! Not only for the public apology but also with not signing up for this Pure Insanity.
Jimi
Bit harsh to ban player like stormspeed (or any other on similar situation) when he just left another club and joined another to get more ice time, it's not like he knew that there was something fishy on the new team. Hell, he barely even know the guys he was playing with.
How ever, banning players who did know that hardwell is hanssonni is justified.
By the way what does permanent ban stand for? They cant play in any tournament ever? On xbox? On ps too? Next-gen?
billy44
Well that can't be true because I got a message from Hanssonni on XBL the other day where he said that since he bought PS4 and was banned from EC he sold his Xbox, and to remove him from my friend list. And XBL messages never lie… Right? RIGHT???
bjono
billy44, You get a minus cause i know guys on crack make more sense than your previus message
Mary and Rose
U mad bro?
janbo
Jimi,

It was not an easy decision in terms of the players that got a tournament ban. However, I came to this decision because I think they either knew or should have known something fishy was going on. I mean if this was so quick and easy to figure out for an outsider, it should've smelled like a wasteland of rotten fish from the inside. All he would've needed to do in case his team mates left him in the blank was to go check their recent games. Something, I think, most players do when joining a team they don't know anyone of. Surely he must've read what was going on with the team (the previous ban and the warnings) as it was purposefully made public in order to avoid anyone claiming lack of knowledge when it comes to the behavior of this team.

Permanent ban is defined as a ban from the site and all future tournaments arranged by Consolehockey. These players broke a rule that has the most extreme penalty in the rulebook. They certainly knew this before trying to pull this off, because the particular rule was already quoted in the first case.
HerraPepe
I wonder what the fuck is this, that I have not even been in the tournament included, I'm not guilty of anything. So I can not understand oikeen tournament ban? Can you explain a bit more detail Janbo.?
login DGS (I am a sPjK nil)
Unbeatable
r3Tu  
Hansulinho
 sold my xbox
TorJaJa
Yo, are u serious? First of all im not that dumb that i would first send msg to my friends on xbl and then change my XBL GT? And yes i can confirm that hardwell gt is hanssonni, but as i already said i sold my xbox to my friend who lives on the same street, and my friend know sleepyhollow coz we r irl friends and he has played ages on ps3 nhl, and coz he always wanted to try to play on xbox so i decided to sell my xbox for a cheap price to him, and coz i hav leg 3 on nhl he asked if he can play with my account coz he didnt want to start from
Amateur. Coz i got bAnned i think that its no idea to have xbox anymore becouse when ec is over its summer, and if i want to play we'll play on ps4 //hanssonni — And you banned whole team that we cant even answer to this and u didnt asked us before u banned us ?? We thought that ban is against hansson not against his friend..so you mean that if he sells his xbox the new owner cant play cause its hanssonnis old xbox thats ridicilous… Maybe next time u will ask before u give permanentbans… -Sleepy — WTF — Priest of evil???
TorJaJa
Why BANNED priest of evil permanent banned without warning and the tournament banned -> Stormi (storm speed)
Spud (spud153)
HocKeyProphEt (TKafSWEDEN)
DGS (I am a sPjK nil)??
Unbeatable
TorJaJa, nice story…
niksa83
comment deleted
billy44
When you got a warning already, maybe it's better to refrain from doing any suspicious actions (like changing a banned gamertag and then registering for EC lol) and inform the guys in charge immediately if you're gonna do something fishy to (try to) clear yourselves in advance. If the excuse arrives after the fact is discovered it looks like you just made it up.

Also good job redeeming your friends with that aggressive post. It's totally gonna work.
comment deleted
janbo
TorJaJa,

No, I didn't ban you in order not to let you explain yourself. I figured you knew how to make a double account. Also, there will be no next time. Think of it as capital punishment.

2§ A player may only register one account per console.

This rule is something you all are well aware of. Including Hardwell if we want to think of him as a real person. Even if you spoke the truth, it wouldn't change anything. Except for the players that got a tournament ban, but then you would need to supply me some real evidence that Hardwell is a real person, which I highly doubt. I think in this kind of a case Hardwell / Pure Insanity would've contacted me about this 'console accross the street and a new player in' kind of a manouvre, or at least they should have before adding him to the roster.
Waaaaat
This is EA(sy). Nice move Janbo. Tournament ban to me stormi!!! why?? 9 games and one week with this guys. And you «think» that i know whats going on. How the fuck would I know?????????????
comment deleted
EstoniaDeluxe
The amount of bullshit (Read: explanations) that surfaces after a thing like this is very sad and stupid at the same time. It's like speeding with your car and when the cops pulls you over you say: «Well I didn't know you were there measuring my speed.»

If you can't manage to have just 1 account for yourself, which is just 1 person, you're either stupid or you have multiple personalities.
Kenu
While I agree that whoever knew about Hanssonni playing with that tag and was trying to get him to play on the team after all should be banned from the tournament, I find it very wrong to ban all of the players on the team.

I played with Pure Insanity a couple nights in the last few weeks and this Hardwell was there as well, but I had no clue that it was Hanssonni. I can't speak for the rest of the guys on that team, but I know that stormspeed would never get involved in that kind of fishy activity and as far as I know, he made the decision to join the team for the tournament 3 days ago.

I understand that it's important to punish bad behaviour in order to keep people in line, but I find it very unfair to ban someone for this activity with any indication that he would have a clue about it. I've played with stormi for years and I consider him to be one of the most trustworthy, honest and fair people to play the game.

I really suggest you reconsider your decision here.
Kenu
Now that I've thought about it for a moment…

I'll add that as I didn't have another team to play for, I was approached by sleepyhollow94 a couple weeks ago and I tried out playing with them. I got an invite to the team on Console Hockey, but didn't accept it yet, as I'm hoping that Geeks will pull through and we will get a team together. (DBK is also in the mix, but I won't get into that)

So in other words, had I not been approached by Jesus and Sikstroem to try and get the old gang together and I had clicked that accept button, I would have been banned too. The fact is that I haven't had the chance to get the guys on Pure Insanity at all at this point, but still I would've been punished for this devious plan.
billy44
I'm not as friendly with stormspeed as some here so I'm fine with the current ruling for the most part, but at the same time I guess I'd be fine if the banhammer only fell on the GM's there, and maybe people who were warned and also on Pure Insanity.
ImSteelD
Hey?!

Tournament ban on -> HocKeyProphEt (TKafSWEDEN) < — ?!?! Wtf, he played in Unknown the last tournament AND he won that tournament with Unknown. What is this?!  He can't be banned.
/ GM for Unknown the last tournaments.
Comment updated:
Kenu
I missed the fact that it was said that Hanssonni wasn't actually playing with that tag. So I'll just point out that when I said «While I agree that whoever knew about Hanssonni playing with that tag ---» I was referring to the opening post. I don't have any proof to suggest that he did. The guys from PI are saying it is a friend of Hanssonni.

I only played one game with the «Hardwell» guy and he sure didn't sound like the way I remember Hanssonni. I'll admit though, that I'm not 100% sure how Hanssonni sounds. I believe Hardwell had a deep voice.
janbo
Thanks for the input everyone.

To Kenu:

Good questions and arguments. The reason all team members were given a sanction was because I think it is their responsibility to know or find out what kind of a team they join into. Who else would do it? The Admin? I tried my best by giving the core of Pure Insanity (core of ex Suomi Predators) warnings and their previous captain a ban in a public statement. According to some statements I've read, some players have not been interested who is playing in their team, they didn't care about a player they've never heard of and whose in-game career point highlights show point totals that should raise anyones suspicion. Even checking out their recent games would've surely said something. So I think that they should have had a clue. They were the people that the information was the easiest to access to. It leaves a big question of why they wouldn't have done so, considering the warnings and all? Weren't you, Kenu, interested in who'd be playing for Pure Insanity? Considering CoG wouldn't have gotten back together (good to hear!), why would you have joined Pure Insanity? Because there were no roster spots elsewhere?

So, in my decision making process I've had to juggle a couple of things:
1) How probable it was that someone would not have known about this
2) Who is responsible for finding out what kind of a team a player joins into

Like I said, it wasn't an easy decision on the 'normal' team members, unlike for the GMs of the team. However, I do think they are guilty until proven innocent and the reasons I explained above. I will and in some cases I have given the players a chance to redeem themselves, but it's a tough cookie. It would rest upon my judgement to say who is telling the truth and who is not. I am willing to listen what say they have on this though.

To ImSteelD:

In this case it doesn't really matter where he played last year. Anyways, willing to listen his story if he contacts me.
ImSteelD
janbo, Last year?! it was a month ago  He just joined them — so he will not have a story to tell. so HOW can he be suspended?!  He hasn't played a single game with that team, he joined «off-season».
alfauros69
After reading all these arguments about janbonators decisions on banning some people I have to point out that janbonator listened to me and gave me a chance to play on this upcoming tournament. If you really feel that you shouldn't be banned/punished for some action just send him a message and discuss with him. I hate to see people complaining to someone who has a tough task figuring out who shouldn't be allowed to play on the tournament and who should be playing.
janbo
ImSteelD,

Well, the logical outcome of that would be that no one could be suspended, because it's a new team and surely no one has played a game for it in Consolehockey.

Maybe a month ago for the finalists, but last year for most!
Kooffein
Janbo has a point though. Hockeyprophet should have been pretty well aware that he was joining up with a team that ran into disciplinary trouble recently, and if he wasn't it's not really the TGMA's problem but rather a player being lazy/careless about what team to join forces with. Same goes for stormspeed. It's unfortunate if there is an innocent victim in something like this, but come on. One can't just go around pointing fingers saying «I didn't know» or «it wasn't my fault» all the time. I truly hope all members of this community have the capability of individual thinking and it's not THAT difficult to figure out the team would be on a shorter leash than most and ask a couple of questions before joining up.

One thing strikes me from earlier in the discussion regarding selling an xbox to a friend that just happens to join up with the same crew. Who the hell doesn't delete ones own live account before a sale, friend or not?
ImSteelD
C'MON…  
Just ban the players WHO played against SIKA in the semis. How hard can it be 
This isn't Russia, and this is not Germany@1939. Don't make it hard for yourself. Check the game-report, and ban the players who participated in THAT game.
U can't ban players who haven't played a single ******* game, in a new-created team --> off-season.
once again, make it easy for yourself.
dawn angel swe
but the players in pure insanity knew that hardwell was hanssoni and he was banned this tournament. so why did the pure insanity players agree this and just be quiet about it and hope that no one would notice it? i guess thats why they will get a ban.
janbo
So you think I should have waited until the first game was played, then go out with the disciplinary actions and give all teams in their group a round of W.Os? This second case had nothing to do with HCS, why would I ban players that played against Sika in semis? I don't think that would be making this easy on anybody.
Kenu
Janbo:

I hear where you're coming from and as I take the game quite seriously, I personally am quite picky about who I play with (in the long run). However, I am every day reminded that not all people think and act like I do and for example change teams with lighter reasons and don't worry that much.

If I recall correctly, I had played with PI one night when I stumbled upon information about their players getting warnings and I remembered the whole incident. Of course it raised my suspicions as I was definitely one of the people who questioned the games they played against HC Sika. That and the discussions with Geeks & DBK was the reason why I didn't right away jump the gun and accept their invite after that one night of playing.
Things that could've put me on that team: 1) stormspeed, 2) enjoying the playing style of the team

But for a person who doesn't have another option and wants to play on a team as for example a starting goalie and time is running out, I don't see why one couldn't take a leap of faith and give it a shot. The other alternative is not playing and where's the fun in that?
If everyone had to know each other in order to play, there would've been no WCW.

While I agree that I wouldn't be conducting business with people I don't know well enough, playing a video game is — in my opinion — a different breed. It also takes some time to get to know people, so I don't find it very unrealistic not to get to know the teammates in a couple nights of playing.

Regarding «they didn't care about a player they've never heard of and whose in-game career point highlights show point totals», pretty much any time I play I come across people who I've never heard of who have a shitload of points. Maybe that's just me being ignorant regarding the community today.

Guilty until proven innocent is not something I would use as a guideline, but that's just my two cents.
Kenu
dawn angel swe,
According to the players of the team, it isn't Hanssonni, but a friend of Hannssonni and some other member of the team.
BulldogMike123
In my opinion these disciplinary action's where valid by the rule books and therefore they shouldn't be withdrawn. But the thing is, these rules have been written in quite a rigid way, and might be seen as little bit harsh in some occasions. That's why I personally hope that the TGMA will keep the line throughout the whole tournament as strict as these judgments have been.

Still I'm a little bit concerned about few things: TGMA has quite a lot power to determine what kind of act is violation of code of conduct etc, and that TGMA said that the base line of thought is «guilty until proven innocent». That is how justice system works in autocratic communities.
Comment updated:
janbo
Kenu & BulldogMike123,

What I meant with guilty until proven innocent was that in my line of thought they are already judged guilty by the evidence and in order to adverse that judgement, they will have to prove themselves innocent. I am actually not calling myself TGMA, because this is an acronym for an association of general managers and I hardly see myself as an association of any kind. Right now, the organisational hierachy indeed resembles that of an autocratic community, because it is. There are upsides to it as well though. I'll admit some penalties are tough, but I believe they were contributed to by more than one admin or 'TGMA'. I will do my best so that the line in rulings will remain throughout the tournament.

Also, the edited rulebook will be published before the tournament starts. The changes mainly focus on fixing loopholes as well as making some small adjustments.
Kenu
janbo,

Alright, that makes more sense.

Regarding Geeks, the team couldn't find a goalie by the deadline, so it will be a pass. Stormi would've made an excellent candidate for that hole in the roster. In that sense someone might say I have/had a selfish agenda with defending him, so I wanted to point that out myself and I do want to underline that my opinion about the matter is as unbiased as I can be.

I'm not saying he's the only one that didn't have a slightest clue about all of this, but he's the only one I can personally vouch for and I think it's very unfortunate if the decision stands.

I think I've been pretty clear with my personal opinion about the issue, so I'll try to leave the discussion to the other parties.
Kenu
Oh and janbo — perhaps you already had this planned, but — I suggest that you try to get the edited rulebook published early enough before the puck drops in the tournament so teams can study them carefully and come with suggestions or questions.

For example the rule that has been discussed a bit:
2§ A player may only register one account per console.

That's interpretable in several ways:
— Register where? I have several accounts on my Xbox and I assume that's not an issue.

— On the site? If it's another player, registering his first account on somebody else console, he has only registered one account on the console.

My assumption is that it means that one person should not take part in the same tournament under several aliases. Even if the player has 3 Xboxes, they can only play on one team.

Of course you can't go too deep into detail on everything either, so I understand there must be some roof for interpretation in the rules as well.

And now I'll truly shut up.
janbo
Kenu,

Hehe, I don't mind at all. You have a lot to contribute here.

It's exactly the kind of things you listed in terms of rules that I try to make better, but I'm sure it won't still be perfect. I wanted to have it published today, but last night Pure Insanity signed up and I've had my hands full today. It'll be done soon so no worries there. I'll make a separate post about the rules and also list the most important changes.
BulldogMike123
Janbo,

I don't say this in a disrespectful to You personally, but I think its a bit challenging when there is only one TGMA member in these seasons, because there can be situations where one TGMA member might have a conflict of interest with the decisions to be made. Also, when there is only one person in governing body, its hard to make impartial rulings. There should be some kind of board of peers to make it impossible to let conflicts of interest inflect decisions being made. Autocracy is never the good way to go. But I'm satisfied if we get this tournament done without any need for disciplinary actions, and if the line will be held the same throughout the whole tournament as you say it would be. Keep the communication routes open, listen the people relevant to the matter in hand before making your decisions and before judging guilty. Then its all done as it should be.

Lets get ready to play some hockey!
EstoniaDeluxe
BulldogMike123,
There should be some kind of board of peers to make it impossible to let conflicts of interest inflect decisions being made.
There is such a board today.
Comment updated:
patovic
holy…
It was Janbo and no one else who decided to step up as TGMA. Where was everybodys interest off these kind off things when there was no TGMA and we needed one?
Janbo for president!
Smokie
Boom
Comment updated:
Hansulinho
janbo for president I agree!!!
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